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Hell, those aren't big ! (Read 136573 times)
Steve Deckert
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If the 1st watt
sucks why continue?

Posts: 2370
Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #195 - 03/22/03 at 01:00:23
 
You are both right.  :o

The sound during the recording that night did not sound like mono then either unless you stood directly in front of the speaker at close range.  A large part of the stereo effect was due to the SPL we were playing the speaker at.  I would say around 100 dB ave.  At that level different tones locate on different surfaces which triangulate around the room in different locations.  At a lower playback level I suspect the effect would be reduced.

You would have heard a stereo image if you stood between the mikes that night, however it stands to reason it should also have been enhanced on the recording from the larger distance between the mikes.

Also, each mike was located on the bottom corner of the grill of a 15 inch loudspeaker with rotted foam surrounds.  I believe this enhances the sound by adding additional delay.

Steve
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Corpsdriver
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #196 - 03/24/03 at 19:58:06
 
I bet you own a Bose system edac... i built my first "surround" system out of 6 old stereo speakers and a tube clock radio when i was 10 nyears old. I was a Professional Audio engineer at the ripe old age of 13. you will really need to come up with something better than that, to make me not "Hear the room" unless my head is in the horn.
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Edac
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #197 - 03/25/03 at 00:08:29
 
Hey Corpsdriver..

I don't profess to know all there is to know at all, I am only relaying a theory.. I have spent six years selling and setting up hifi - not long perhaps, but long enough to have experienced a few things..  As to your reply, well, it is slighty ambiguous.. Perhaps you should have set aside your copy of "Valve Manual: 1936" when you were ten, and picked up "English Language For Beginners".  I can recommend the section titled "How To Communicate Effectively With Anything Having An IQ Above That  Of A Hedgehog"..

No Bose system in sight here, sunshine.  Just tubes, and efficient speakers..  Thats why I'm here at Uncle Steves'.

Pull your head out of the horn.  Love Edac.
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Corpsdriver
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #198 - 03/25/03 at 15:47:21
 
My apologies, for coming off like Gomer Pyle after a colonoscopy, I had quite an attitude yesterday. (oh, and double the apology for the Bose incinuation!) The point I WANTED to make was, of all the theory in the world, only about 1% stands up to practical application. (ie. Bose... All show, no go.) My claim to fame (as it were) came from using rooms during recordings, not by close micing in a dead studio and adding it all back in electronically.

Love backatcha,
Jamie

P.S. that was Valve Manual: 1972
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Edac
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #199 - 03/25/03 at 18:22:07
 
Jamie, we all have our off-days!  

I agree wholeheartedly with your sentiment about "theory".  I have set up enough subwoofers to know that theory/reality are seldom the same!  You should see where some of them ended up!

Congratulations on the friendly reply to what was an intentional stir.  Considering there was no such thing as Valve Manual: 1990 when I was ten, I have to bow to the superior knowledge I find on sites like this.  Everything added to these pages is valuable in one sense or another.  

I'll NEVER forgive you for the Bose thing!!  Although I am off to Police college, those little bunk rooms requiring nothing more than a little cube + sub of some type..  Needless to say - DIY will be the key.  Maybe some Imperials on a 1/15 scale!!

Cheers, Cade.
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MikeS
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !/ wood horn lenses?
Reply #200 - 04/17/03 at 16:31:24
 
Steve,

Did you ever make any drawings/plans of the wood horn lenses?  I did very much appreciate the Imp. plans you made available!

Thanks,
MikeS
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sparkplug
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #201 - 11/07/03 at 23:34:57
 
I can't believe I'm posting on somthing said almost a year ago.  I'm about half way through this thread, and I couldn't resist.

<As I applied the varnish, while it was still shiny and laying on top of the surface, the sound would come out of the varnish!  Just a 6 inch square area in the throat raised the presence by 3dB. It was unmistakable, yet I couldn't believe it.>

Could this be caused by the air density change caused by the varnish vapors??

Jake
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richard03
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #202 - 11/08/03 at 18:00:51
 
has anyone got any predictions for how a pair of imperials would perform outdoors , any feedback would be much appreciated....thanks
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Brian
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #203 - 11/09/03 at 16:41:44
 
Hello richard03,  
Indoors a speaker usually has some bass cancelation nodes caused by wall reflections.  These cause the bass to have dips at various frequencies.  Because of the lack of this rippled bass, I believe any speaker would be more perfect out of doors than in.  
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Brian
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #204 - 11/09/03 at 16:45:24
 
Sparkplug, Your air density idea seems plausible to me.  
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weasel2htm
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #205 - 11/11/03 at 03:04:25
 
I've Played both the wac and the mp3 on a variety of systems (but no HT systems yet)  WOW  Home system Sansui 5000X and Paradigm Phantoms  Sounded cool, wow Played in my car, worn out Coaxials Stock Tape player and DB12 The car is where I got an Idea on the depth of the room and was in general shocked (the DJ talking is what sounds cool) Played the recording through the youth room sound system at my church (EV PSX2000 Powered Mixer 500 watts/ch and 4 Sound Tech speakers with 12" woofers and horn tweets) I had told a friend of mine about this thing and I gave him the website but he could not believe the treble from the 15s of this speaker the room is too echoey for much stereo effect.  OK now that I got my rambling out of the way I will sya one thing about this speaker  WOW  I have no room for something of this size so I guess the phantoms will have to continue doing their job.
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strobe
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #206 - 12/16/03 at 21:25:00
 

[quote author=Brian  link=1040842968&amp/195#205 date=1068396324]
Sparkplug, Your air density idea seems plausible to me.  

[/quote]

RE: <As I applied the varnish, while it was still shiny and laying on top of the surface, the sound would come out of the varnish!  Just a 6 inch square area in the throat raised the presence by 3dB. It was unmistakable, yet I couldn't believe it.>

I'm not so sure about vapors and am more inclined to the theory of some sort of surface tension dynamic.  Wonder if some fuzzy material (like a velour) coating the throat area would have a similar effect by affecting the compression wave transmission into the horn material?  Thoughts?
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Braggi
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #207 - 12/19/03 at 17:44:46
 

[quote author=strobe  link=1040842968&amp/195#207 date=1071609900]


RE: <As I applied the varnish, while it was still shiny and laying on top of the surface, the sound would come out of the varnish!  Just a 6 inch square area in the throat raised the presence by 3dB. It was unmistakable, yet I couldn't believe it.>

I'm not so sure about vapors and am more inclined to the theory of some sort of surface tension dynamic.  Wonder if some fuzzy material (like a velour) coating the throat area would have a similar effect by affecting the compression wave transmission into the horn material?  Thoughts?
[/quote]

I've heard over and over how important a smooth surface is to the function of horns. What could be smoother than the surface of a fluid? I imagine that sound waves are affected by friction. Reduce the surface finish (that is, make the surface smoother) and the sound will flow better, especially at high pressures like in the narrow throat of a horn.

Mystery solved?
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morpheous85
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #208 - 03/22/04 at 04:25:30
 
You have my vote.

Jason
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Braggi
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Re: Hell, those aren't big !
Reply #209 - 10/21/04 at 04:30:52
 
OK, time to return this thread to the top of the heap, may it live forever!

Well, I never read whether Steve D. liked his Selenium 2" drivers or not on the big HF horns so I'll assume they're nothing to crow about. I have a pair (three actually) of Emilar EA-175 drivers They're only 1" exit but they sound very good. I have a lot of other mid/high compression drivers to try too and several different metal horns. Will someday build some wooden horns though not sure which design or manufacturng process I'll use.

For now I'm putting siding on my new woodworking shop. In a few weeks I'll most likely get started on my first pair of Imperials. I'll try out my 30 year old Altec 421-8LFs in them. I have four. I imagine I'll like 'em. If and when money allows I'll probably buy Altec 515s for the second pair.   Smiley
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